Rivers of Blood

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  • This is going to be controversial, I guess. But then maybe not, it might just be ignored. I have undergone something of a revelation however, in reading Enoch Powell's infamous Rivers of Blood speech in full for the first time. Not the propaganda that is put out about it but the actual text. Now I am certainly no supporter or admirer of Enoch Powell coming as I do from the opposite end of the political spectrum. But we shouldn't permit our personal prejudices to blind us to the realities. Much of the language he used was coarse and crude, the examples he used to emphasise his point erroneous, and I wont bore you with a detailed deconstruction of his every word. I will, however, use these bullet points. Though I must point out that these are not necessarily direct quotes but extrapolations thereof. Powell insisted that all citizens should be equal before the law but this does not mean that the immigrant and his descendant should be elevated into a special or privileged class. He also argued that the passing of anti-discrimation laws, or indeed, positive discrimation, would be used to discriminate against the indigenous population; and I wonder how many of us have been here: " they found that employers hesitated to apply to the immigrant workers the same standards of discipline and competence required of the native born worker." He also said that while many thousands of immigrants want to integrate there are just as many who do not, and some have a vested interest in fostering racial and religious differences with a view to domination over their fellow immigrants. Given the recent terrorist threat and from where exactly it has emanated, particularly in the UK, this makes perfect sense. This was the speech that last year the Guardian newspaper refused to include in its series of Great Speeches because they said it was negative and fostered racial hatred. As Powell said himself at the end of the speech, " All I know is that to see, and not to speak, would be a great betrayal." Our great betrayal is not to have listened.
    Porscha
      September 1, 2009 10:00 PM BST
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  • Hi Porcha,thats brave of you and I dont really want to take issue with you but firstly I can remember that the Afro-Carribean community were the ones who were getting pilloried-if he was referring to our muslim 'brothers and sisters' (and I shudder at my cynicism),I would more than concede he had a case but possibly because of his Indian Army connections he expressed horror that he might have meant this.
    I also think he might have legitamised the remergence of the far right-Mosleys' grisly crew-but then again though the National Front became as I remember a serious threat (the Left never were,I was one of them!) we 'saw them off'' in the 70's and though the BNP gives cause for concern I dont beleive Powell can be blamed for this. I didn't like the man but Idont think he was a racist or even a fascist in fact his war record proves he killed many of them.
    Further in his defence is his courageous stance over British brutality to Maumau prisoners-that was a noble thing and puts our current politicians to shame.
    Perhaps his intervention cleared the air as my generation were far too complacent about the strength of British democracy compared to our european neighbours-what with the troubles in Ireland and elsewhere I think that we have had to swallow a lot of pride which can only be a good thing
    At risk of being a bore things werent all that wholesome in the 50's-I remember on my first trip to London;(!)and how proud I was of all the bomb sites!) seeing notices advertising apartments but with the proviso-No coloureds or Irish-the good old days of the 'gentile' 50's ,what!
    Great stuff-still dont like him though,Nina PAPILLON-XX
      September 1, 2009 10:57 PM BST
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  • 734
    Dammit, I'll have to dig out a copy of the speech and have a peek! I'm surprised if - as you say porscha - his language was 'coarse and crude' as he was very well educated and very much an ambitious politician. Not to mention, according to good old wiki, 'a British politician, linguist, writer, academic, soldier and poet.' He would have known a thing or two about the written word! We all know, of course, the edited highlights.
    Enoch Powell was certainly no rascist and, I suspect, his speech was very much earthed in his Wolverhampton constituency that had just seen a major immigration influx from the West Indies - up to forty occupants in a three bedroom property etc. Scenes and activities completely alien to the country at the time. Whilst he is often wheeled out as an example of bizarre racism it is often overlooked that he was a man of his time talking about his time and is very anchored in 1950's Britain. The Britain he talked of then was so different to the one we have now and, IMO, it is ridiculous to qoute him today as it would be out of context.
    My views are assisted by Enoch being a close family friend of my lodger and having had many a discussion about his character.
    That said, it'll be interesting how this thread pans out...

    Nina, whenever he is a darling of a rascist faction, I would suggest he is being seriously misunderstood.

    Rae x
    www.raekelcou.com
      September 2, 2009 12:27 AM BST
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  • It's been a long time since I saw Enoch doing his Rivers of Blood speech on telly but I seem to remember his eys glazed over and he was rocking back and forwards as if in a trance...
    what he failed to see or perhaps was misquoted for was the fact those immigrants he was mentioning actually integrated quite well into society and filled a lot of the then available jobs...
    that they overfilled houses was perhaps due as much to the lack of housing in those days due to the mass bombings of the war as to the slum landlords packing rundown houses or any inherent desire to live 50 to a house...

      September 2, 2009 7:15 PM BST
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  • 734
    Good points Rose, quite agree :)

    Much love
    Rae xx
    www.raekelcou.com
      September 2, 2009 8:23 PM BST
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  • I'm no racist, I have friends from varying backgrounds and in fact am myself an immigrant in Germany but I do think he had a valid point. Aren't we all after fairness in the workplace after all, regardless of race, colour or creed? I do think that too much positive discrimination has set in and have seen that in many job advertisments who want certain applicants 'because this faction is lacking in our infrastructure' or words to that effect.

    I have also seen the rise in immigrants who make no effort to integrate, both in Germany and in the UK and I firmly believe it is wrong. You can keep your own culture and still intergrate into another successfully, and if the other culture is so radically different, why settle there in the first place?

    I think the UK should adopt a points system for immigrants and seriously limit asylum seekers who are in the UK for a 'free ride' rather than fleeing for their own safety.

    The writing was on the wall for me in '96 during the world cup (I think, sorry I hate the game), when the English in some parts of the country at least were prevented from flying their national flag in case it offended ether minority groups!! Excuse me? I can't fly my country's flag?? I don't think that's a country I want to be part of any more.

    Nikki
    Every woman is beautiful, some show it with their faces, others show it with their hearts.
      September 3, 2009 7:10 PM BST
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