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Effects of Estrogen

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  • Here's an interesting story about the effects of Estrogen from Texas radio station KXAN36 in Austin.

    http://www.kxan.com/Globa[...]2982718

    Could explain a lot!

    Hugs,

    Katie x
    Success is the ability to go from one failure to the next without any loss of enthusiasm!
      February 23, 2005 12:19 PM GMT
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  • Interesting... Thanks.
      March 19, 2005 12:52 AM GMT
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  • I havent started any hormones yet but really wish I could.
    Worried about liver toxicity and stuff like that.
    Maybe i'll aim for lasers for the hair thing and try topical cream/gels

    I dunno.
    I always seem to sit on the fence.
    I know what i want, its making it happen seems to be stumble point.
    When on own is difficult.
    The science blurb is so difficult to understand though, i'm sure i shouldve studied to be more knowledgeable in these things.

    Looks like they saying on one hand ok, on other not ok with the stuff, where do they think we should go with that. no definition .
    Confused and a bit frustrated, I remain greatful for the info and for this site. Thankyou for your tremendous commitment Katie.
    patience is a virtue, or is it simply a card game, and whos the dealer?
      June 15, 2005 8:17 AM BST
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    Hiya julie, ive been taking hormones for about 7 months now & have had good results (check out my photos in my profile & here)
    I have also been getting laser on my face (only 2 times so far) again with good results so far! They told me the lower the testosterone levels the better results for laser!
    Anyway although im self medicating I have had a full check up liver, kidney, blood, thyroid etc & all was normal.
    I think (as most of the info sites tell you) everyone reacts differently to hormones.
    Hope all goes well for you.
    luv,
    Angel xx
    angel
      June 16, 2005 5:43 PM BST
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  • Julie,

    I hope I have answered your questions off line, but did wish to add some things for all members. Hormones are nothing to be messed with unless you understand that they will impart changes on your body and psyche that will not reverse when you are done taking them.

    If you want to enlarge nipples and grow breasts, take them for a while and then stop; they won't disappear when you stop. But do so only if that is your true goal.

    Let your primary care physician know what's going on, and then realize that you'll feel great when you start the program, normal as you continue to do so, and awful when you stop (you'll go though an abbreviated version of the same process as a woman going through menopause, basically, with all of the joy that it entails...).

    Hopefeully this is of some use to you or someone else.

    Spoken as one who's "been through the wringer" on this topic...

    Sincerely Yours,

    Kari
      June 16, 2005 7:44 PM BST
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  • My godness... seven months and you grow those breasts?

    Sorry, Hi!!! I'm Daniela and I'm new to these forums. This is my first post, but I've been reading since a few weeks ago. My first language is Spanish, so please excuse my crappy English.

    Back to the topic... those breasts are at least three times larger than mine, and I've been on hormones for almost a year and half. For comparison, may I ask: how old are you? What is your regime composed of?

    Thanks
    Daniela Buenos Aires, Argentina http://www.flickr.com/photos/danielab/
      November 24, 2005 1:20 AM GMT
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    sorry i only just read your post daniella! its now 10 moths since i started, im 39. remember everyone is affected differently by hormones, I guess im just lucky that Ive had fast results. Actually ive not had a lot of growth since those pix were taken so maybe I have peaked!?
    im taking ethinyl estradiol & cyproterone acetate (androcur)
    Im just about to start on estrogel tho.
    good luck,
    luv,
    angel xx
    angel
      November 24, 2005 5:22 PM GMT
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  • Moderator
    3 1652 3‚ 0
    hello daniela and welcome. you look absolutely gorgeous, if i looked like you i wouldn't be too bothered about my breasts!
    i've been taking estradiol for a year and am about a double-A cup, which means small. one has to be patient.
    xx
      November 25, 2005 1:35 AM GMT
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  • Thanks for the welcome, gals!

    I'm 31 and I've been taking hormones for 16 months, but at first my regimen was very soft. I'be been automedicating, and I know it's wrong, and fully understand the consequences.

    I started with Gynovin (Ethynilestradiol 0.03mg / Gestodene 0.075 mg) and later Diane-35 (Ethynilestradiol 0.035mg / Cyproterone 2mg), 1 or 2 pills/day. That was for about 5 months.

    Then I investigated seriously and found that regime inadequate. Starting again gradually, I'm now taking Estradiol gel 2mg and 100mg Spironolactone / daily. I moved to this city only two months ago, so I'm now looking for a endocrynologist who works with transgendered people.

    Daniela.
    Daniela Buenos Aires, Argentina http://www.flickr.com/photos/danielab/
      November 29, 2005 5:27 PM GMT
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  • Moderator
    3 1652 3‚ 0
    I took spiro for a year, but found if I took enough estradiol I really don’t need it (as it blocks testosterone), a point which was confirmed to me on my recent visit to my gender clinic. 2mg is low, use more Oestrogel it’s far safer than increasing spiro, and is likely to help more with breast development. I do four squirts a day (3mg) plus 2 x 2mg Estrofem (oral estradiol), I’m sure on that amount the spiro doesn’t help at all, which is why I stopped some time ago. Always “ramp up” gradually to a higher dose though, and get your blood pressure checked regularly. Soon as you can have liver function tested and all the rest as well.
    xx
      November 30, 2005 12:22 AM GMT
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  • Moderator
    3 1652 3‚ 0
    Indeed Kristelle, thank you for your clarifications, Estradiol will only partially block testosterone, not totally, which is what I meant. My point being that I have found testo to be sufficiently blocked to not require taking anti-androgens. For once I agree with our National Heath Service with regards to that point.
    I also agree with Kristelle that blood pressure and liver function are pretty safe from the effects of Daniela’s low dosage of oestrogen. Spiro is used as an antihypertensive and so lowers blood pressure, maybe there’s a potential danger if your blood pressure is already low, so it wouldn’t hurt to keep an eye on it, and I would also add that it’s a good idea to monitor potassium levels whilst taking Spiro, as potassium is retained and too much can cause hyperkalemia (potentially fatal).
    Whether any tests are really needed or not, as I said, it can’t hurt to have them, if only for your own peace of mind. Our NHS certainly think that on any regime tests should be taken regularly, I neither agree nor disagree though, just pointing that out.
    Back to Daniela’s post, I see that she says, “starting gradually I'm now taking Estradiol gel 2mg…”
    Gradually is good, but I would have thought that a month or two is sufficient ramping up time, and then estradiol dosage needs to be increased. 2mg is kind of post-op level, unlikely to be enough for sufficient breast development. And if you do consider oral estradiol, then perhaps tests become more important; I also believe that transdermal delivery is just about the safest method. One thing’s for sure Daniela, your earlier regime was not what I would choose. Whilst I have seen good breast development from ethinyl estradiol in several cases, it’s something that I am avoiding, for health reasons.
    As always, individuals vary, so I am generalising to some extent. I’m a firm believer that hormone regimes need to be tailor-made to suit the individual, there is no hard and fast rule as to what will work and what won’t, but we all need some guidelines as a starting point, and comparison with other people’s regimes I find extremely helpful.
    xx
      November 30, 2005 4:06 PM GMT
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  • Could anybody offer their thoughts on what I've been taking of late - 200mg Spiro (orally, obviously ) and 4mg of estradiol sublingually.
      November 30, 2005 9:40 PM GMT
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  • Moderator
    3 1652 3‚ 0
    Can you be a bit more specific, Rhia? How long have you been on this regime and how happy are you with the results so far?
    My initial reaction, having taken spiro for a year is that it’s not really necessary if you take sufficient estradiol, as I said earlier. It is the oestrogen that gives development as I’m sure you know, so maybe that could go up to 6mg per day if you’re not seeing much change after several months. On that sort of dosage you might find stopping the spiro or at least cutting down to 100mg makes no noticeable difference. That’s what happened to me anyway, everyone is different, so you’ve just got to find what works best for you.
    Without knowing how effective you feel your current regime is, it’s hard to comment really, if you’re already a B-cup then stick with it!
    xx
      December 1, 2005 2:24 AM GMT
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  • to be honest, not long. I was on it for two months, but stopped taking it a few days ago due to poor planning (I ran out). Obviously, I spend a month before that building up the dose so it wasn't too much of a shock to my body.

    I was taking it mainly for emotional effect. Not that it would be like some mirical cure for the way I was feeling at the time (which was pretty bad - suicidal at times), but I did guess that it may help me to improve the way I was feeling, which it did. Having not taken the spiro now for about 10-12 days, and haveing not taken any estrogen for 3 days, I've started feeling pretty damned bad again, which I know is partly down to the hormonal disruption, but there's also an underlying feeling to it which I can only assume is the result of testosterone.

    I felt quite comfortable with the dose, and I have seen a small amout of breast development which is just an added bonus really - (as a friend told me, quite crudely acctually, "two breasts and a hole doesn't make a woman". She is of course quite right and I agree). That said, I can only wish I was a B-cup! I was probably about half an A cup to start with, and now I'm just coming up to an A. I haven't been taking them long though, so that's to be expected.

    If I had the money and the choice, in all honesty I'd go with complete chemical castration (just as I've always said. lol)

    What I find very odd though, is that while I did notice some emotional differences (not incredible differences, just a slight change that helped me to feel a little better about myself) while taking them, I felt that after I stopped taking the spiro I felt almost no different initially. It's only since the estrogen stopped that I've felt the change. I have a new supply which should be with me in a few days (thank the heavens!) but I still haven't quite worked out which tablet is doing what.

    I had been taking 1mg (100 microgrammes) of ethynil estardiol about a month before I started the rest of the regime which seemed to have little emotional effect (unsuprisingly - not in a month anyway), but it was when I started taking the spiro that I felt my depression lift ever so slightly - very strange.

    I've never been a straight-forward case in any respect, and with all the changes in regime I've had in such a short period I've probably done myself few favours, but I'm just wondering on the 'normality' of the regime I've been taking and shall continue with in the next few days as a stable dose over a longer term.
      December 1, 2005 3:04 AM GMT
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  • Absolutely Sandra, I realise also that some of what I'm feeling is due to a certain placebo element, another part due to the influence of hormones (or lack of them as it is at the moment! lol), and that some of it is quite real based on due to day rubbish I'm having to deal with.

    I think to be honest the reason I posted was mainly for a little re-assurance on the levels of the medication. I'm pretty sure it's ok (I spent long enough over the past 2 years doing some research and looking at what others have said). I just have a lot on my mind right now on top of my day to day issues, and I think perhaps it's had me questioning everything a bit TOO much if you know what I mean?

    Thanks for your reply Sandra. With what you said with regards to the testo - estro thing and their emotional relationships, I think I understand what's going on a bit better now.

    As for the testemonial, don't worry about it. I meant every word, and I when I saw you in amongst the online users, I thought it was about time (first one I've written too! lol)
      December 1, 2005 4:55 AM GMT
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  • Thanks Kristelle!

    I investigate a lot before taking any medicaments, because I still haven't found a good endo, but I've been reading your posts and you seem to be a quite knowledgeable person , so I'm going to take your advice.

    Lucy is also right, it's about time to think of increasing the estrogen dosage (Ginatex here in AR). I know it's safe but it's also a tad on the expensive side . Also, it comes with a dosificator that pumps 0.5mg for each application, that means 8 pushes for 4 mg -- I would end up all covered in gel! I've got to find another way. Looking in a vademecum I found Ronfase or Estrofem 2mg comp x 28 but that means orally. I could take 2 tablets/day. Or combine gel with tablets. What do you think?

    Regarding Progesterone (AR: Progest), I think I could start right away. Do you think I should wait? How long?

    Water, I'm drinking about 2.5 litres daily (0.6 gallons) sometimes a bit more, is that OK?

    Thanks for your advice, Kristelle and Lucy!

    PS: For reference:
    All the products containing Estradiol I could find on pharmacy are here:
    http://www.prvademecum.com/PRData/NEWPrincipioActivo.asp?D=1600
    And Progesterone:
    http://www.prvademecum.com/PRData/NEWPrincipioActivo.asp?D=1033

    Daniela Buenos Aires, Argentina http://www.flickr.com/photos/danielab/
      December 1, 2005 12:45 PM GMT
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  • Moderator
    3 1652 3‚ 0
    Daniela, I use Oestrogel (from globaldrug.net) which delivers .75mg estradiol per pump, so I do 4 of those a day to give me 3mg plus another 4mg taken orally (sublingually actually). I’ve experimented over a period of time and this seems to be working well for me, better than just 6mg taken orally for example. So I think combining Estrofem (what I take) with a gel is probably a good idea.
    Am I right in thinking that Progest is a progesterone cream? Maybe orally would work out cheaper, and I'm sure safe to take (make sure it’s micronised progesterone). I take 100mg for 10 days every month, and am very happy with that.

    Rhia, I do think that with 4mg estradiol you could at least cut your dosage of spiro to 100mg, and after a few more months you might find you don’t need it at all, The only benefit from spiro is that it reduces testosterone, and estradiol will do that for you on its own.
    Emotionally, I’ve found I have less of a tendency to get down, but I honestly can’t say whether that is the hormones or my greatly improved personal situation over the last year, maybe it’s both. I have heard that progesterone can help with depression, but don’t know if that’s scientifically backed-up.
    xx
      December 1, 2005 2:50 PM GMT
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  • Kris and Lucy:

    OK! I'm taking Ronfase 2mg (17-B-Estradiol), and keep with the Ginatex (idem), 2mg daily. I'm swallowing the tablet because it tastes awful! Why do you recommend taking it sublingually?

    I keep with Aldactone-A (Spironolactone) 100mg and I added Progest 100mg/day (Micronized progesterone). Progest here seems to come only in tablets, not cream, so don't worry. And for the drowsiness/dizziness --- don't tell me about it, the first time I looked like I was on booze!

    I'll keep this regimen for two months then we'll see what happens .

    Thanks again girls, you're so sweet
    Daniela Buenos Aires, Argentina http://www.flickr.com/photos/danielab/
      December 5, 2005 11:25 AM GMT
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  • Moderator
    3 1652 3‚ 0
    Estrofem just tastes sweet, not at all unpleasant. There is some debate about whether taking estradiol sublingually has any added benefit, the thinking, in simple terms, is that more of it is directly absorbed into the bloodstream, as when taken orally the liver metabolises a large percentage of estradiol in the “first pass”. Of course Daniela, if your tablets taste disgusting then it’s not an option!
    Your regime sounds like a sensible progression, good luck, and let us know how it goes.
    Kristelle, thanks for the extra clarification about the spiro, I took it for a year and didn’t notice any adverse effects when I stopped so I don’t plan to go back on it. I’ve never suffered from fluid retention, in fact have a tendency to become dehydrated (despite drinking 2 litres of water a day, more when I was on spiro), so I don’t think it’s for me. It may well be beneficial to others of course, but do observe the cautions about drinking extra water and avoiding excess potassium in your diet.
    xx
      December 5, 2005 2:20 PM GMT
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  • 588
    If this is the case, Kristelle, there shouldn't be that much of a difference between gel/patches and oral administration ? But is it really possible to make a reasonable estimate, of the amount swallowed vs that entering the bloodstream ?

    Linda
    “To be a poet at twenty is to be twenty: to be a poet at forty is to be a poet” -- Eugene Delacroix
      December 5, 2005 4:44 PM GMT
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  • 588
    Thanks, Kristelle. I'm still on my 100mcg patches, but I'm trying to find out as much as I can, just in case. It does seem, however, that the patches could be enough - if only I could have twice the dosage I'm on now. After six weeks on 50mcg and another six weeks on 100mcg my breasts show some clear signs of growth and much heightened sensitivity. (exhilarating at times...)
    This makes me wonder what results I could have with optimal medication. I'm clearly not on that now. And it's not too clear when I will be.
    Still, the recent development does give me some hope.

    Linda
    “To be a poet at twenty is to be twenty: to be a poet at forty is to be a poet” -- Eugene Delacroix
      December 6, 2005 8:18 PM GMT
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  • 588
    Yes, Kristelle, it is great news. But, as you're saying, at some point, and quite soon, the dosage must be raised. On some other thread I think you mentioned the question of desensitivisation of the estrogen receptors. I really don't know, but perhaps a slow raising of the dosage could be of some "added value" ?

    I'm seeing my therapist tomorrow, and my TG doctor the day after. So, I'll keep pushing them...


    Linda
    “To be a poet at twenty is to be twenty: to be a poet at forty is to be a poet” -- Eugene Delacroix
      December 7, 2005 12:24 AM GMT
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