creatures- hmm - odd-per -spective- so best of luck- on other world's - eh ??

Hi girls

Passing has also a darker side. In the form of sexual harrassment. Yesterday I got a not invited guy at my table in a cafe and sooner than I noticed his hand was on my upper leg. I took his had off firmly and totally calm and said that is not allowed. He kept on praising how georgeous woman I am. Well, he did not leave, so I had to leave. I start to face also the not so nice side of being a woman.

Laura

My mistake was that when he told me he was a former well known tango singer I gave a short laughter. He must have taken that for an invitation. I just must learn not to look at men and never smile at them. But I´ll learn, don´t worry .

Laura

Laura,

You don't have to go off all men. I work in bars so deal with drunks all the time. People are oftern at their worst in bars.

You just have to learn how to deal with it. I tell so many girls to watch what they do and just make sure that they only allow men to do what they feel comfortable with.

If you continue to have problems ask for help with one of the security. If your at a place with no security ask the bar tender or even a differnet guy. I know that most guys would help a damsel in distress.

Its just a case of being in control of the situation. I never have any problems in bars as everyone knows who is boss, even if I'm not working. I'm not the kind of girl you can mess with and get away with it!

I can remember a couple times in the past being out at a gay bar not dressed, just everyday guy me, & it happened, so it isn't limited to gyrls & G.G.
A firm no, especially like you physically stopping him, is the way to go. Yell/curse if it still continues.

I dont mean this to sound bad in anyway, but it must be nice to know men are thinking of you sexually, i mean like they are seeing you as a woman. Even though they are a pain at least you are getting noticed by men and im sure every woman goes through the same thing on a regular occassion when they go out. Just have your pepper spray on standby!

Sounds like your applying the "all men are barstards" approach.

They're not just be careful and firm. Just because your a woman doesn't mean you can't tell a guy with an unwelcome advance to get stuffed. Use your common sence, so you can sort out who does deserve your phone number or email.

If you tar them all with the same brush your treating them with the same sort of contempt we ourselves have to fight against!

Sandra,

with that I'll agree!

maybe they need to be given a little extra blood, that way they will be able to think a little past "woman, me want..."

There are alot of footballers getting in trouble for things like sexual harrassment at the moment here in Australia. What the governing body is doing is giving them all courses in how to treat women. Maybe it should be introduced to all schools world wide and made compulsory for every boy to be taugh it.

Luckily most of the guys get back when you say "No thanks". And that is a thing the woman should do. Otherwise they just go on... And they are not embarrassed about the "no" nor mad....they just pick out the next object . So, your smile or politeness is an invitation to certain men, who understand only clear words as NO.

Laura

Your right Fiona, in the Uk footballers think they are gods but i think they act the way they do towards woman because lots of girls throw themselves at rich and famous men, so they get egos and think all girls want them!

in the UK footballers ARE gods!

thats how they are treated. I couldn't believe the cover you give to football and footballers while I was there.

lol, Gloria.

Ps. I love Footballers wives, that show is awesome. I never really understood it till I was living in the UK though.

Gloria,
God I had to laugh when I read your comment, I resembel that remark. I think the world should be run by women but there are just as many women that are jerks with an atitude and desires to control everything their way. You know that there are just so many people out in the world that have a real problem with being a decent human being to those of us who live to be a good person. It will always be a problem and we do have to learn how to deal with it in so many different situations.

WoW- Sandra taking the negative view-hmm. In our "native" culture the people called such persons,"contrary's",Hmm seems to fit somehow- riding yer horse backwards and all!! better to castrate em all- or put a shock coller on them eh??- AS a TV- YER TALKIN'-ABOUT ME,, TOO- is this the lesbian branch of- castrate all men ??!! "K"

what?

- women- are oppressed- OHH - - I guess that's news - like in Iran or ??? everywhere- ?? You make progress??? "K"

Laura's experience is just the sort of thing that scares me and is a primary reason why I avoid bars altogether. I have been hit on a few times, and I find it uncomfortable, but fortunately, the men who have hit on me have taken "no" for an answer.

Genetic girls, of course, deal with this kind of problem all the time. One of my friends (a genetic girl) is very firm about brushing off unwanted attention; she can get downright mean about it. For example, she has punched men in bars, and she has been known to tell men that she has a disease (if I remember correctly, syphilis is her favorite). One man she got together with occasionally as a friend became infatuated with her and would not leave her alone. After telling him nicely a few times to go away, she got extremely verbally abusive towards him; I was amazed at some of the e-mails she sent him, and I was amazed at how long he persisted. Finally, he got the hint and left her alone. I hope I am never faced with similar situations. I would hate to have to be cruel like that (it is not in my nature), but if I was pushed far enough, I believe I could do it. Maybe I could go to my friend for advice.

Sometimes men become emotionally infatuated with certain women and in that state, they will not listen to reason. They may need a jolt to snap them out of it. However, I think it is best to keep it in the verbal domain; my friend is probably taking a serious and unnecessary risk when she physically assaults an unwanted suitor. Especially in my case, since I sometimes carry a gun with me (this is legal with a permit in my state), I do not ever want to see a situation escalate into violence because I never want to use that gun against anyone.

Again, bars seem to be the worst place for this sort of problem. I handle it by avoiding the bars most of the time and by not getting drunk when I do venture inside. For those who go to bars anyway, I would advise you to keep your wits about you (in other words, don't get too drunk) and be prepared to find a bouncer or head for the exit if necessary and don't start any physical confrontations. Also, don't go to bars alone. Where I live (and I assume in many other places), women don't usually go to bars alone unless they are looking for men. If you are alone, you are a target. If you are with friends, you will have some back-up if a drunken fool starts to cause trouble. Finally, if that same drunken fool somehow discovers that what is between your legs does not match your outward appearance, things can get very ugly very fast; that situation could ruin your day or end your life, so be careful.

Heather H.

with-Who Sandra - hmm- don't worry- eh?

First of all Laura, I'm sorry to hear that you had to deal with that. Unwanted attention, is just that unwanted. Unfortunately when most people start to drink or have certain preconceived notions about a club or its clientele, their judgement goes out the window. I used to work with campus security several years ago and I still give the same advice to women of all persuasions.

1) When possible, go with a girlfriend or group or meet someone there. If meeting someone for the first time, have a friend call you every so often and let them Know where you are and what you'll be doing. If you have a cell phone, keep trusted friends numbers on speed dial.

2) As one of the other girls said (I believe Fiona), do your best to stay in control of the situation. Be blunt or rude if necessary, call security, or just step to the Ladies Room and leave. Just keep things on your terms.

3) If it is legal where you are, carry mace or pepper spray when you go out en femme.

4) Lastly, make sure you keep some cab fare and the numbers for a couple of local cab companies with you whenever you go out.

Take care and be safe.

Regards,

Braums

Thanks Temujin

My situations were actually not scary, more annoying. And I left right away. And you are right about better not sitting alone. You just cannot help sometimes dropping in somewhere on your way home in order to have a soft drink and use the ladies room.
I have noticed that I get now scared of things I never used to. I never open if a stranger rings my doorbell. I´m just too scared.

Laura

As an elderly Tranny I feel I must add my two cents worth here.
In all the time I've been in public as a woman, I have never entered a bar. This is just tempting fate and asking for trouble, we are what we are, men dressed as women, unless of course we've gone through sexual re-assignment. I have not been around this forum for quite a while because of all the "piffle" which is posted here, I came back today and found that nothing much has changed.

This forum used to be a good place to come but in my opinion it is now elitist. I cannot afford to become a paid up member as I am a pensioner so I don't know what goes on in the elite section.
On reading through the posts available to me I find most are about what appears to be "wishful thinking" for the most part. Let's face it girls not many of us would pass in public especially during the daytime added to which if we were approached and spoken to who of us would be able to answer without giving the game away with our masculine voice?

Just my two cents worth.

Well Wendy

I know here a dozen of ts women who pass in every situation 100%. I don´t know that many cd:s to be able to tell how they pass. Those who live full time, as I do, passing is a must.
And passing is one prerequisite for my SRS. Without passing I would never even think of the SRS. Who needs a man with a vagina?

Laura

I'm sorry if I seem to have "tarred" you all with the one brush but I did exclude those who had or are going through sexual re-assignment. As for "passing" I find that I pass very well in public and always have, however if approached, my voice is a dead giveaway. I don't go into bars because that's where men are looking for a pick up and it's just asking for trouble. As for all men being Pigs, what a generalisation, for the most part men are decent folks. By "piffle" I meant nonsense, nothing more nothing less, we're all prone to talk this way at times and most of us tend to exaggerate our little "adventures" or misadventures
sometimes.

I don't want to carry this argument on so I will end by saying that if I have offended anyone on this forum I am sorry, this was not my intention.

hi laura, i can't say i've experienced it yet cos i haven't been out at night dressed but i'm sure i'd be ok.I'd just tell him firmly.. No i'm not interested.you are right in that if you were in trouble,that another guy would rescue a "damsel in distress".lol maria xxxxxxx