Hi! I'm Katie, I'm a newbie here, hello everyone.

I've been on hormone for almost 4 years now. I began with the therapy under a nurse, on shots and pills. But I've been moving around, so I had to go self med. I've been buying pills from the Inhouse Pharmacy.

I feel that when I was on shots, my body was more feminine, so I want to start giving myself shots. I know which kind to buy, and I think I know how to do it.

Where do you girls buy the syringes?

Katie, first off welcome to TW. Your simple question is very difficult to answer because the right answers can vary immensely based on where you are located. I live in the U.S. and can drive 2hrs south to another state and buy them at any pharmacy without a prescription, but in the state I live in I cannot buy them, even online, without a prescription. What I am saying is you need to know your local regulations first.

Next, you said you "think" you know how to do it. Giving yourself injections is something that must be done right. I highly recommend that you find yourself a trained professional to show you the proper way. You also mentioned Inhouse pharmacy, their injectable estradiol comes in glass vials that need to be scored and opened. It is imperative you use filter needles when filling the syringe. Are you aware of those requirements?

I won't get upset at you for self medding but I'm sure you know you would be better off having access to a doctor regarding this stuff. I've been there between doctors. As far as injectables, I have a doctor's appointment at 8:45 tomorrow morning for my next shot and I agree with you that injectables seem more effective. The thing is, I would not do injections without a doctor. Pills and patches last days in your system, injections can last several weeks so if you were to have complications, you want a doctor that knows what is going on. My two cents worth.

Love,
Marsha

Thank you Marsha!

You're right, I shouldn't been doing this by myself. (But I have been for the past two years.) I need liver function test, two years over due. I do read as much as I can about hormones, though. I think it was you who commented somewhere in the forum that sometimes, us girls know more about HRT than doctors who don't treat trannies as normal practice, was it? It was a good point.

So, not even online? I am checking out this site called Allegro Medical, and it doesn't say anything about that. I live in Panama for the moment, but I have an address in Miami. I wonder if my order will be intervened.

I didn't know about the filter syringe. Thanks. Score the glass vial? Does it mean the vial have the metal or rubber seal that needs to be punctured with the needle? I did have my nurse show me how to do it. I've done it for a girlfriend once. I don't know about the "fiIter syringes" though! What is that? I'm so scared of syringes! I have to go google it.

I've started the therapy with the shots, so I know I'm compatible with Estradiol Valerate.

But, all this is scaring me. I have to sleep on it. Maybe I should stick with the pills. But pills are worse for the liver and the blood clot. Ah!

Thanks again Marsha!!!

Again with the risk of hitting a vein or main nerve I highly recommend having a trained professional show you how to do it versus just watching and thinking you know what they did. Florida does happen to be a state you can get syringes but double check current regulations.

Injectable supplies can be ordered online, many veterinary supply dealers also carry the same products. From what I have heard the Inhouse Pharmacy ampules are single dose ampules therefore no rubber top. There is supposedly a tool that can be purchased that easily scores and opens the glass ampule. As far as opening the thing without the tool I have heard gals score the neck of the ampule with a knife or something then break off the top. The reason for the filter needles is to prevent glass particles from being injected into your muscle.

Again I highly recommend a doctor. I understand what you are saying about oral E and liver issues. Have you considered gel or patches? Prior to injections I used gel for about 2yrs and was happy with the results. I also have several friends satisfied with the patches they are using. Lots of options are available out there. Have I mentioned try and see a doctor.

Love,
Marsha

Here are a couple links for ampule openers

http://www.sepha.com/cl.htm

You can order them in the US from here
http://www.hcl-intl.com/m[...]re=7371


Once again I don't condone self medding and would hope you will find a doctor. Tools like these openers will make it safer for you. Note I said "safer" not safe.

Marsha

Thank you very much Marsha and Selene!

I was given a sample of a syringe from my nurse, and I was going to just order that. But it doesn't say anything about filter.

So, if I use this vial opener, I don't need the filter syringe though, right?

No, not right. You still should use a filter needle to atleast fill the syringe. The tool scores the vial but you still snap off the top which has the potential for glass particles to still enter the medicine. We are talking minute particles and that is all it takes to wreak havoc within muscle tissue. You sound familiar with multidose vials with rubber tops, a filter needle is not required with those. BTW, you use a second need to inject with to clear that question up.

I understand you are trying to learn as much as possible so you can be as safe as possible. Sometimes the more information you learn tells you that you need to do things a certain way and you should involve a doctor. You cannot ignore that. I go to my doctor's office every two weeks for my injection and both my wife and I can sleep well knowing medical personnel are in charge of my medicines.

I have been there with self medding. That is why I am very familiar with the different meds, doses, how they are taken, blah blah blah. The bottomline is there was still times I was scared that I might be harming myself. Also the worry I caused my wife. Self medding is one more way we hide who we are and all it does is add another burden to our shoulders. I have no problems with you getting your meds from Inhouse or wherever you want, but you should atleast have a doctor aware of what you are doing. Patches and gels are clearly satisfactory substitutes to injections and you certainly should consider them if you insist on self medding without a doctor.

Sorry about preaching,
Marsha

Yeah Marsha I tried all kinds, too. I've been on the gels for two years, but I quit using it at the end of the last year.
I didn't like it very much. I think I will settle for high dose estradiol and dydrogesterone for now.

I am in a transitional period right now and I might move soon, so I'm going to wait till I'm a little bit more settled to find a doctor. It's not like I don't want a doctor, I had one to begin with. I've been moving a lot is all. It's frustrating that things aren't going my way for the moment, and I thought I'd find out about shots, you know? If I move soon as I plan to, I know I can find a doctor where I'm going, and shots for good price.

Anyways thanks a lot Marsha. You didn't sound like preaching, until you said you're sorry about the preaching.

I am sorry but I could not help but get involved in this one. There are several good reasons to go to shots and just as many against it. But I am sure you would know all the risks and rewards.
I would not look at using a diabetics syringe and needle set as the needles are of no use to you unless you have an hour or two to get the very viscous medication through them, also so they are just way to short and would not get you to the inter muscular area you desire.
For snap tops filtering is important as Marsha said.
The half life of shots is much longer than that of pills and patches and will take an average of four to five weeks to clear the body.
As for giving yourself the shot it dose mean contorting a little but it is easy enough the biggest thing to look out for in not hitting the sciatic nerve that is really not a good thing to do and is very painful. As for hitting a vain it will happen from time to time but there is a simple test for that and if you do hit then you move the area a bit.
Next week is my last shot before my GRS so I my be able to tell you what it is like to come off meds after three years of shots ……..not looking forward to this bit

Hugs
Sara

Hi Anne Selene and Sara Lynn,

Thank you so much for the input.

Ok, so, I was on the same gel you are using. I did not see much result, although I applied constantly, and a lot, because I wanted to get estrogen in my system without stressing the liver too much. But I live in the tropics, it's probably as hot as Thailand, and it's sticky. I just never felt comfortable with that stuff on my skin!

Also, I tried all sorts of progestine, except for the shooting kind. I started on the medroxy progesterone, I think it was working, but I also think it was a little bit virilizing. (and it gave me wild mood swings) Not too much, probably because I was on shots and estradiol orally too. And then when I left town and moved here, I did some research and tried micronized progesterone, and estradiol valerate. This combination did not work for me at all. I think maybe the dose of estradiol valerate was too small for the micronized progesterone.

I went back to estradiol sublingual and gel, and quit using progesterone. I tried spiro, too, but it didn't have much effect on me. I'm not hairy or masculine and my nurse had told me I don't need anti-androgen, and she was right.

I also tried Premarin. I don't like it. I'm on it right now, but I'm going back to estradiol sub lingual. I am also on dydrogesterone right now, and I am very happy with this stuff. It makes my body soft and round and my boobs feel like they are full. It's expensive though at $1 per pop.

So, I think I'm going to buy three months worth pills, estradiol and dydrogesterone. And hopefully I will be in Japan in two months or so, where I have an easier access to doctors and shots. If I will be here in the tropic longer, then I'm going to find a friendly doctor to monitor my body and give me shots.

And good luck Sara I hope wish you the best for your GRS!

Geez Katie, I don't mean this in a bad way but you are all over the board on your meds. Dydrogesterone is synthetic progesterone. I think I mentioned in another post how your body is like a puzzle. You have receptors (the empty spaces) for the chemical molecules (puzzle pieces) to fit in. Progesterone molecules are similar to estrogen and therefore will fill the same receptors. In order for breast tissue cells to grow they need estrogen, the stronger the better. You have estrione and estradiol 17b, estrione(E1) is the weaker. If progesterone or your synthetic dydrogesterone fills that receptor you will not get the desired growth. Progesterone is primarily used by GG's for maternal reasons. It is still debatable whether TS's need to take progesterone at all. One thing for certain is a high dosage of progesterone will slow feminization. Many gals will cycle progesterone for 10 days a month with the idea that the breasts will round out. I have been there done that and no longer bother with progesterone and am doing just fine thank you.

You mentioned your nurse said you don't need an anti-androgen. How does she know that? Bloodwork is an important part of HRT, whether you self med or have a doc. Anti-androgens don't have to be used with the proper dosage of other meds but you will have a hard time safely reaching that on oral meds alone.

I am not a doctor or an expert of any type so take what I say as information that you should checkout yourself or discuss with a doctor. My biggest concern is reasonable development with safety. Other gals have different motivations and maybe feel it is worth a greater risk to obtain faster development. One of my favorite lines is: It is not a race. If you insist on racing, atleast try to finish the race.

Marsha

Hi Anne,
Thank you for your comments and your best wishes on my up and coming GRS that was very sweet of you.
I will be happy to tell you the strengths of my shots which are custom made for me and I have Marci Bowers to that for this as she developed them along with my ob-gyn / Endo. The ingredients are all natural 2mg 17â-estradiol and 50mg Progesterone per milliliter and I take 2mls a week intramuscularly. This gives me an E2 count of 240 to 270 which put my body in the ovation / lacteal phase permanently. Reducing mood swings to a minimum and development to the maximum.
One thing to remember though is not to over use the hormones though as they can stress the kidneys, liver and heart even with injectables. Oh and another thing that over taking shots like high dose shots is that your cholesterol will get out of control in a hurry so look for lower dose taken if possible weekly.
As was mentioned the half life of intramuscular shots is much longer and if you are in high dose trouble it will take much longer to dissipate some where in the region of three to four weeks as apposed to 5 to 9 hours for an oral form.
Oh another thing if you are sexually active then beware of the side effects which happen seemingly quicker lose of libido, and chemical castration, in many cases quicker shrinkage. So starting this you should be considering GRS with in a year or two. As the longer you leave it the less material you will have for GRS and grafts may be needed which was my mistake.

Hi Katie
Thank you for your comments and your best wishes on my up and coming GRS that was very sweet of you as well.
How you med is totally up to you but I would advise you get and LFT and E2 test to see how you have tolerated all the bouncing around you have done. Then try and settle into one regimen that you know you can get where ever you are. If you can try and stay away from synthesized hormones and go natural.

Hi Marsha
I see you are still doing all your home work and drug research. True Dydrogesterone is synthetic progesterone which really makes it a progestine mimicking progesterone. However I understand it is a very well tolerated drug.

You girls are scaring me to death. What's LFT and E2????

Sarah,
I don't dispute any good or bad reasoning on the progesterone debate. It seems like there are equal numbers of supporters on both sides of the issue. Progestins versus progesterone have been shown to be unhealthy, but progesterone as far as I have ever come across is extremely safe. For those that don't know, progestin is what is in many birth control pills, not progesterone, two different chemicals. Progestin is thought to be a major concern on blood clot issues. Blood clots equal strokes, heart attacks, and possibly death. That is why even if you self med you should have a doctor involved one way or another.

Another issue on progesterone is that the $14 progesterone cream available OTC at Walmart and other stores is just as effective as the $100 prescription Microgests and the like. As a general rule progesterone stays in your system only for minutes and fills available receptors before breaking down or getting flushed out through the liver. With the injection method it is basically a continuous slow release of a low dose into your blood.

Again, something worth discussing with a doctor.

Huggs,
Marsha

I know, I know! It's really motivating me to get a doctor so I know what's up and can feel alright about my precious precious body!

It's an embarrassing story so I don't want to post it, but I have personal reasons that's making it difficult to see a doctor. It involves a man. Sobbs. It's why I moved here and also why I'm trying to leave here. Anyhow, I should be able to see a doctor soon. Meanwhile, I'm eating healthy, a lot of blood thinning food, and don't drink or smoke, and doing yoga and pilates 5 days a week, so hopefully, I'm as healthy as I was two years ago. I should probably healthier than then. I'm doing more than ever for my health and looking and feeling better than ever, thank goddesses!

About the oestrogel: It never felt like water. Sometimes it was thick and sometimes it was thin, but it ended up feeling sticky in the end all the same. Maybe it's because I like to feel nothing on my skin. I take shower twice a day and like to sleep with nothing on, so. I varied the dosage, but I was putting on 2 to 4 pumps at a time. Maybe it was too much for the area of my skin. I'm pretty small and there is not much places to put that stuff.

Thank you all once again and bless you all!

Hi ya Anne
I will have to ask Marci exactly what the brand is, I know they both come from Belgium and are blended here in the US just for me. Now days I pick it up at my local pharmacist / compounder who has been approved to blend it for me.
Oh bye the way if you want pop down to Bangkok around the end of May and I will introduce you to Dr Kamol he will be able to answer any question you may have about castration and GRS. Though I think Thailand has just passed a law at the moment banning castration I think it had some thing to do with very young people but I am not sure. You may need to look into that.

Hey Marsha,
I think I will start using you as my where to go girl …… all your research is paying off …..I have missed chatting to you. And you have learned so much since we used to beat around the bush. Lol…. I look forward to bantering some more soon.

Hi ya Katie,
I think you are getting some good advice here honey …… and it is good that you are keeping fit and in good health….. Please just get a check up at some point and feel safe with what you are doing. You sound like a nice person and I would love to be chatting to you 20 years from now

Any how hugs to all …………..love you all to bits and I think you are all wonderful people …………Blessed be to all

Hi ya Anne
I will give you the addy i will be using there for sure ........i will be there from May 18 (arrivel) to June 14
Will be emailing you soon