Stevie:

Luv 'n hugs,

Jayne Sakura
"Almost-Angel, T-Girl Genius, and Ultra-Flirt"

Now, regarding the connection between the distribution of wealth and overpopulation, I don't see a direct link.

Hi all--
Amazing. I don't see a direct link, either.

I do see a direct link between too much unprotected sex and overpopulation, however...!

I'd like to think it all has to do with money...or jobs...civilized/industrial...or even culture. But the truth is, it doesn't.

No...the sad fact is that too many people are simply having unprotected sex. :o It doesn't matter where you live, or your socio-economic status. Unprotected sex will lead to children...as well as a bunch of other, far less pleasant, things.

How you get them to voluntarily stop...now if I knew that, I'd be rich as well as smart and good looking. :Enforced sterilization is not the answer...nor is forced abortion. (Sorry, Beijing. You lose. Play again. >:() I don't see "quotas" working, either.

Salary Caps: Yeah, right.
(I need a raspberry .wav file... ;D)
Ricka, sugah, get real. It'll never happen. Not in any sort of Crapitalist Capitalist society worth its bottom dollar. How would you enforce it? Use the Patriot Act?Besides...it is only the love of money that is the root of all evil. (Okay, so everyone needs roots.)

Even using Mr. Gates as a subject...What happens when you have been a successful capitalist is that you get penalized, under that system. A quick and dirty study of American History from the mid-1800's on shows that would not have sat well. Just ask JP Morgan. Or Rockefeller. It is the American Dream to become filthy rich.

What I'd rather see than a income cap, is a realistic, liveable minimum wage...and a simplified taxation system that doesn't take 32% of my income away every year (like, say, a 6% flat rate tax. ;D).

Luv 'n hugs,

Jayne Sakura
"Almost-Angel, T-Girl Genius, and Ultra-Flirt"

The subject of population came up in the environment thread.  Instead of responding there, I thought this issue could use its own thread.

I propose that most of our problems have overpopulation as a root cause.  Certainly the high human population has massive environmental consequences:  high pollution, habitat destruction, bad farming practices, etc.  It has also been shown that overcrowding in just about any animal species can lead to violence, which is one of nature's ways of keeping population under control.  Overcrowding also encourages disease, another of nature's population-control methods.  Humans have tried to overcome these population-control methods and have been partially successful.  The result is an exploding, unsustainable population.

At some point, if we do not do something to slow things down, nature will take control, and it will be ugly.  Our population will get so large that our technology and medical science will be unable to sustain it.  Famine, wars, and the possible extinction of our species will be the result.

Now for the difficult question:  what can we do about it?  The right to reproduce is jealously guarded by most people.  The last thing we want to see is the government controlling our reproduction, but if we do not slow down voluntarily, will there be any other choice?  In the industrialized world, birth rates have slowed, so such controls may not be necessary.  But in the undeveloped countries, birth rates are often so high as to do severe damage to the economy, thereby insuring that those countries will never reach industrialized status.  Medical science has done a good job of reducing disease and encouraging the survival of more people, but birth rates have not dropped accordingly.  More education is certainly needed, but cultural norms may be hard to combat.  Some of the worst affected countries probably need a one-child policy like China's, but they likely do not have the resources to enforce it.

Does anyone else have thoughts on this subject?  It is at the root of many of our problems, but it is difficult to solve.

Heather H.

Don't look at me. 'Taint me...unfortunately. :-[

Luv 'n hugs,

Jayne Sakura
"Almost-Angel, T-Girl Genius, and Ultra-Flirt"

Jayne, I was with you all the way on your last post, until you brought up that minimum wage business. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/fashionlab/Images/Smileys/Laugh01.gif  Oh, well, 90% agreement is still pretty good!

Now, regarding the connection between the distribution of wealth and overpopulation, I don't see a direct link. I don't see a need to limit the number of children a couple may produce, either. Some day in the future, drastic measures like that might seem less repulsive, but for now, I think it's a bad idea.

Ricka, you would cap all incomes? You do realize that the word communism is going to have to be brought into play, don't you? Why would you want to tell someone he can't make more than you see fit? Someone like Bill Gates, who is a multi-billionaire, has created a lot of wealth for others as well as himself. He has also been an asset to our economy over the years, and he did as much as anyone to bring widespread computer use into households and businesses. If his income would've been limited, he might  have pursued a different career.

With all due respect, I'm 100% against placing limits on income. We shouldn't be encouraging class envy. Most people who are extremely wealthy deserve their wealth. Why punish them for success and/or good fortune? Their wealth belongs to them and it isn't anyone else's to redistribute. If I want/need more money, it's my responsibility, and mine alone, to go out there and do something about it. I shouldn'r rely on the government to take care of me, nor should I want the government to cut anyone else down to size to make them financially equal with me.

Also, there isn't a fixed amount of wealth in the world. We create new wealth every day, so just because someone else earns more, that doesn't mean you must earn less.

I'm against anything that has to do with telling people how to live their lives or making people the same. That's the same mentality that keeps trannies in the closet. Communism is all about conformity and arbitrary limitations on the human spirit.

One question, Ricka... does your $100,000 cap apply to the government, as well? If so, you might be onto something, there! http://mywebpages.comcast.net/fashionlab/Images/Smileys/Laugh01.gif

Ricka
An income cap.Interesting concept.Some years ago,I recall our top rate of income tax was 98% (yes,you read that right!).Result-Many highly skilled and top earners left the country.I think the same would happen if any form of restriction was placed on pay.I nearly said earnings,but no-one 'earns' that kind of money.You said 1m.Why that figure? Be careful not to reduce any incentive.

Overpopulation.
Most of the worlds worst overpopulation seems to occur in the 'third world' countries.The root cause is a viscious circle of infant/child mortality.We need more children because so many die young.They die because we can't feed them properly,or give them medicines they need.We can't do that,because we have too many children.And we need more to support us when we get old.And we need boys.This despite the fact that women do most of the real work!

I believe more resouces need to be directed towards education,not just in terms of schooling,but also in social and economic ideals.Reducing the population will actually mean a better chance for survival,rather than trying to improve the odds by increasing it.And persuading dictatorships to spend within their country, not on ego trips,weapons and nepotism.

The industrialised countries are not immune to the overcrowding problem either.Medicine has helped increase the population of elderly,to the point now where they outnumber the young.Life can now be sustained well beyond it's natural term,and with all due respect,what can we do with them? There is much to be learned from their experience,but when the mind has gone...I do not want to end up kept alive by a machine,not knowing who or where I am.

I do not want government to dictate to me about children. I have one,and that will be all.Any thinking adult should be satisfied with one each.If you don't want yours,let someone else have it.

Sue.X

.... I don't either. Maybe under a quota system we could get payed???

More seriously though I entirely agree with Heather (gosh, that took some saying). It's interesting that once people are raised from poverty birth rates do tend to drop like stones so perhaps the capitalist exploitation of cheap eastern labour will actually bring some unlooked for benefits????

There are also some interesting anomolies. In the poorest parts of India male children are prized above female to the extent that female children may be aborted or in the worst cases killed, either directly or through neglect. This has led to a huge gender imbalance in the population that must surely bring down the birth rate.

Brutal. Humanity, red in tooth and claw.

Sarah

Hey, it's not my fault. I don't have any children. http://mywebpages.comcast.net/fashionlab/Images/Smileys/Wink01.gif

Lucky us.We have a minimum wage.And though I'm not for one moment suggesting any form of cartel was in action, when it came in,most starting pay at most firms became...National Minimum Wage!
Strangely enough,this rate per hour was often less than the previous starting pay.

And another thing.Who's getting all this sex(protected or otherwise).'cos it ain't me!
How about a national minimum for that?

Sue.X