September 12, 2009 2:35 PM BST
Sorry for the late reply but Katie has already answered the questions posed about the thread anyway. I did hide it by accident, a mistake made by me because I couldn't remember quite how to suspend it, which goes to show how few times we have to take such action. That's a credit to everyone here as differences are usually able to be resolved before it goes too far and gets out of hand.
I agree with Lynn's comments regarding prose vs speech, as humour and sarcasm can easily get lost in print and the reader takes the point made in a completely different manner to what was intended. I think this is particularly true when dealing with individuals from around the world, even if they have a shared language, so we should all be aware of that. For example, the way I deal with the British military here is very different from the way I deal with German nationals, and rightly so, as they are very unlike each other and it is important to approach them in a way they understand and are comfortable with. (Just try walking up to a German in the street and saying, 'Oi mate, got the time?' - a harmless question or an offensive remark?)
Finally, as a reminder to everyone, if you do have a particular point to make to someone that is personal, please use the PM's or email rather than the public forums.
Nikki
September 12, 2009 8:21 PM BST
"Finally, as a reminder to everyone, if you do have a particular point to make to someone that is personal, please use the PM's or email rather than the public forums."
Just wanted to underline Nikki's excellent point. I'm sure I can't be alone in definately not liking to see the use of insults and bad language in any of the forums. As I don't, incidently, out in terra firma.
In my view nothing could turn people away from TW faster.
I did bring up a point that Marsha made and we did correspond privately on the matter to each's satisfaction. IMHO that's the way to do it. Whilst the debate got a little out of hand here and there, I certainly don't have any problem with Marsha's moderating of the thread.
Rae xx
September 13, 2009 1:45 AM BST
Marsha it was YOU who used the phrase, " a piece of Dirt" to describe the town of Lockerbie & that was WELL out ot order.
Anna-Marie
September 13, 2009 2:09 AM BST
AM, hunni,
I understand your sentiments.
On the surface, what Marsha posted did come across as insensitive. Hence my response to her highlighting that fact. However, please bear in mind my post in reply. I took what she said at face value. I corrected it and deliberately stated that I believed it was a misconception. I stand by that. Please bear in mind that not everyone in other countries will either remember or appreciate that Lockerbie was - actually, still is! - a town. And that 'dirt' in Americanese can just as easily mean 'land' in the Queens true language. Whereas to us 'dirt' means just that. Dirty, unclean etc. Hence 'piece of dirt' can be incredibly insulting to us but over the pond might just relate to what they call 'real estate'... [Yet to figure out what a false estate would be!]
And, of course, it could just as easily have been a turn of phrase, a quickly written keyboard response.
Several reasons for it to have been a completely unintended insult.
Personally I think this topic - if you'll excuse an incredibly bad and unintended (but unavoidable) pun - has been done to death.
Let's let it drop. If anyone has a need to come back on it please let it be Marsha to put the thing to rest.
Rae xxx
September 13, 2009 10:20 AM BST
Nina,
Sometimes the Gremlins in the server double-post a post in the forums. Sometimes they do not post it at all. I have had this happen to me a few times and it was just a glitch. Fortunately it is not common. Sometimes the slightest lag can throw off a program which has a timing sequence in it. Please do not take it as a personal action against you or anyone else when this happens. In fact, taking actions on forum posts is sufficiently complex that we are sometimes criticized for NOT taking action soon enough. As Nikki pointed out, we use "delete" commands so little that we forget where they are. I am still trying to remember to do my posts on a WP and then copy them to the forum so that I do not lose them. It is always best to check that your post actually posted.
September 13, 2009 3:12 PM BST
After reading Anna's post I can see we need to be carefull about jumping to conclusions about what was ment.
What Marsha said is a common phrase in the U.S. & I understood it fine. I couldn't understand what all the anger was about.
Now had she used the word "dirty" you would be right.
September 13, 2009 3:22 PM BST
Wasn't it George Bernard Shaw who said famously that England and America are "two nations divided by a common language".
Looks like nothing's changed.
Hugs,
Katie
September 13, 2009 5:00 PM BST
It was, he did, and how true.
Also to be considered:
"You guys are both saying the same thing. The only reason you're arguing is because you're using different words".
Attibuted to S.I. HayaKawa
and
"I know you know what I think I said, but I'm not sure you realise that what you heard is not what I meant".
Source unknown.
September 13, 2009 6:54 PM BST
Amen!
Nikki
September 13, 2009 7:57 PM BST
Nina your post say just one thing. You WANT to fight & argue. So have a good time with it.
September 14, 2009 12:28 PM BST
To quote myself:
'Finally, as a reminder to everyone, if you do have a particular point to make to someone that is personal, please use the PM's or email rather than the public forums'
Please adhere to this ladies.
Nikki
September 14, 2009 10:46 PM BST
Karen, i thnk in a way i did jump to conclusion here....but then i guess thats just me. write first & ask questions later. But it wasn't the smartest thing to do after a Wee Dram or 2.
Lol xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Anna-Marie
September 15, 2009 1:42 PM BST
At least the misunderstanding has now been clarified.
Nikki
September 15, 2009 1:42 PM BST
I have to say it's very good to see the participants in the original thread 'owning up' to saying that they didn't mean to offend, or that yes, things may have been interpreted wrongly and perhaps over reacted on. Hat's off to you girls!
It does show how easily a harmless comment can be misconstrued and cause so much anguish and upset, unnecessarily. I'm sure many of us are guilty of it too. A witty response that is taken seriously, or a phrase that is not common outside of a particular country or region. How about the sarcastic and often dark humour that is seldom understood outside of the UK for example.
Nice to see we can make up and move on, life's too short to do otherwise.
Nikki