Hi All-

I thought I would share this test with my TW sisters. It does seem somewhat more "scientific" than most. I'd be curious to hear what others think of it, not necessarily your results, those should be personal, at least if you want to keep them that way, but just what you think of it in general. Maybe this should go on the "Psychology" forum, but I thought it might get more exposure here.

Here's the link: <http://www.bbc.co.uk/science/humanbody/sex/add_user.shtml>

Hugs, Joni

Joni, ya beat me to it.

But just to make life easier for the hard of typing, here's a clickable link to the same thing

http://www.bbc.co.uk/scie[...]r.shtml

I came out as 50% female (which is about the same average score as genetic women who have taken the test) Very detailed, and you have to answer honestly.

While you're there take a look at "Tomboy or Sissy" on the BBC parenting site ...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/pare[...]2.shtml

.. ain't the Beeb great?

Cezza xx

Hi Cerys-

Thanks for making it clickable and thanks for the other link, too. I scored 50% male, which leaves me wondering exactly what it means, does it mean I'm 50% female then? If so, it's kind of how I see myself anyway, half-and-half. I scored high on male things like spatial orientation but higher than the average for genetic females in things like empathy and judging emotions.

Anyway, an interesting test or set of tests and much more "objective" in some ways, than others I've run across on the net. I'm hoping more TW girls take the time to go through it.

Hugs, Joni

I got 25% female in that test, so with me being a quarter irish(gran was irish) and a quarter female, no wonder I'm messed up

25% female for me. I would say the test puts a little too much weight on the positioning of thumbs though...

Linda

50% male. When I came to Tweb it was to help me figger this out.
I'm still confused.

Playing the deviled-egg's advocate....and relating to Cerys's link on Tomboys and Sissies....are humans more strict on "gender-appropriate" behavior with boys than girs because....

They have to be...boys are the ones fighting to change from a female XY embryo to a male XY embryo and more likely to "fall off the turnip truck". Therefore, there is some species need to "keep us on track" because we "need" it. Also, biologically speaking and ignoring modern "civilized" patterns, women are more likely to get impregnated despite their desires than men are to impregnate if they have no desire and therefore "tomboys" do not threaten species survival in a non-liberated society. Even a hundred years ago there were not many choices for women than marriage and being "bred".

Not a conclusion; just a proposal for thought and study.

Wendy,
It seems to me you are partially contradicting here what you, very wisely I think, wrote on Native American culture in the thread "I told my mother": "Western culture makes a set of rules/religion and then explains nature in a way that fits those rules, no matter how they have to twist it to do so." And this often means "twisting" boys harder.

Linda

Hi All-

To be honest, I don't put a whole lot of credence in online tests like these, though this one seemed a bit more "serious" than some others I've seen. Although I have to admit to a smidgin of bias here, if this test had shown me more over on the female side, why then I supposed I'd be tickled with it. Pink, of course.

My own feeling is that the only real "official" way of finding out what your orientation is (aside from how you feel inside and how much external validation you feel that needs)would be to spend some time in counseling with a professional who would undoubtedly administer a series of various "objective" tests and also spend time interpreting them and discussing your feelings, familial background, social interactions, childhood experiences and so on.

There! That makes me feel better about scoring so high on the boyside and rationalizes it all away.<lol>

Wendy, sis, I assume that was a typo and you meant that all us start out as XX female and are "forced" (I seem awfully fond of " signs this morning) into XY mode by in utero doses of testosterone.

And in a way, I suppose you're right to some degree, however, a bisexual male would still serve the purpose as far as species propogation as would a TG male or CD male. Perhaps not so much a TS although biologically "he" would still be as capable as any other male. Personally I think socially determined male behaviors don't have as much to do with the biological continuation of the species as they do with social intertia. If it was good enough for granddad, it should be good enough for us, in other words. As you know many other societies have been more tolerant of transgendered behaviours than our current Western cultures are. Just thinking out loud, so to speak.

Hugs, Joni

Linda,

The two explainations are not mutually exclusive. The answer may be A, B or A&B....or more likely All of the above and more.

I agree, Wendy. But can we change those genes to make boys suffer less ? A tempting thought...

Linda

Linda,
That idea scares the Hell out of me. You know the first people they would change, to reduce our "suffering", would be us. Clearly, to them, no male who was not "suffering" would choose to be a woman in preferance to being a man. Further, I am a biologist and diversity is a positive species-survival trait. We accept that it is a laudable thing for individuals to suffer for the good of society (as in a war). Perhaps that concept should extend to the species. It is unnecessary suffering, due to the distorted belief's of groups, that I object to. Worship as *you* choose, but do NOT make me live by *your* faith. I should not have the right to make Christians or Moslems worship as I believe...they would agree with that immediately. There must be freedom for all or none have it.

Joni,
Not an error, my dear sister. All eggs, both XX and XY start as females. The chromosomal nature of each affects how the egg develops. The XX female-egg becomes a female child..most of the time. It, in fact is not "forced" to be male. The XY female-egg develops into a male due to chromosomal differences and hormonal influences. It ends up as a male or, in the case of TG children, stops at a local stop on the spectrum, not complete in it's transition to being a male. The transition many of us face, as adults, is a retro-transition to return from whence we started our life. Even Governor Arnold S. started life as a "girl"-egg.

I'm glad you said that, Wendy. I do feel that I made a stupid comment there. I got carried away by my emotions. My question - "but can we change those genes to make boys suffer less ?" was, at first, seriously meant: I did not think that the genes could be changed in such a way, so why not concentrate on changing what we can - society - to make boys suffer less. But then, of course, understanding the biological functioning of our species would be part of that.

Linda

i did this brain-sex test and failed miserably!!!! 50% male lol anna-marie xxxx

We're in the same boat Anna-Marie, I scored 50% male which actually kind of accords with how I feel about myself> I'm both in about equal measure, hopefully the better parts of each, but I can also be a bitch and a bastard sometimes, though I try hard not to be.<lol>

Hugs, Joni

Sandra,
How can you be wrong if you're feeling better just knowing you are who you are ? The question is, I guess, if there are some female abilities that you want really badly after all.

As for the test: I scored in the lower range on the spatial orientation test. I admit to being not very unhappy about that. Which could at least partly explain why I made such a low score... This does not mean that I cheated. But for the last few years I have been increasingly fed up with abstractions. So, sitting there and looking at those "space cubes" I could actually feel the resentment. I have been doing this kind of twist-your-mind-test before, but never with such a bad result as now. This obviously has got something to do with the emotional upheavals I'm going through. One month ago this came to a head while learning some computer programming. I was well on my way, but then my emotions got the upper hand. I even tried to rationalize this with saying to my self that Java was a stupid language - being more abstract than C. This was only days before the dam broke and I "came out" to my mother.
So, I have some hope that I will make a somewhat better score on the "space test" when I become a more content woman.

Linda

Actually this was a test to assess how t-girls, especially TW t-girls, feel about being tested.<lol> The results tended to fall out as they usually do in tests such as this, 25% found the test to be fair and accurate, 50% found the test silly, pointless and biased but each one for an entirely different reason and the remaining 25% didn't take the test but enjoy talking about other tests they've taken.<lol>

ALso, as usual the test is skewed toward those who like to take tests online even if they think they're pointless and silly, approximately 50% of the target group. Of the other 50%, half were sleeping it off after a night of partying and the other half were playing with makeup and handwashing their lingerie.

Okay, just kidding. Of course as Sandra and some of the other girls pointed out, we t-girls is complicated critters. Things like gender, expression, orientation, sexuality, favorite lipstick color and why we do what we do, are much more complex than any 30 minute online test can measure. Personally I'm one of the ones who kind of likes taking these tests and if it accords with how I feel about myself that particular day, then it's a great test and if it doesn't it was a pointless waste of valuable time that I could have been using to play with makeup or washing my delicates.<lol>

Hugs, Joni

Hi girls,

I also took the test and unfortunately scored 50% Male...so it can't be very accurate because I know I'm more female than male
Some interesting questions though. I did really well with the facial expressions...got 9 out of 10...girls usually score higher than boys in that one...so I felt good about that part of the test

Hugs,

Monika

Hi Monika-

I guess it's really not too surprising that so many of score in that range, given the circumstances of our situations.<lol> I scored 50% male also and to be honest, I felt a little pang of disappointment "this thing can't be right!" when I saw my results. But after a little reflection I realized it probably is fairly accurate or as accurate as something like this can be. I do have both masculine and femine traits as does nearly everyone. I don't feel like I'm a woman in a male body but I don't really feel all "mas macho que tu" all the time either, I'm some of both in roughly equal proportions.

It's funny but I scored high on the facial emotion recognition part, too, 8 for 10. I've always been able to pick up on what people are feeling from gestures, facial expressions, verbal cues and so on, a decidedly feminine trait. But I've also always done well in things like "what would this look like if turned 270 degrees and inside out?" kind of questions.<lol>

I thought the thumb on top thing was interesting but something I think you would have to do totally without thinking for it to have any significance if it has any at all. The finger ratio thing was kind of neat, didn't someone post that a few months ago, was it you Cerys? My left hand is femme, the ring and forefinger are exactly the same length, but my right hand is male with the forefinger noticeably shorter. I may need to get a finger extension done.

Mostly I think we should enjoy this gift we have to be able to be both male and female and work to be able to express them openly in our lives as much as we can. I think we all know who we are even if we don't know why.

Hugs, Joni

oh gosh Nancy, I'm not in denial about that part at all.<g> I'm more of a lipstick lesbian though.

Hugs, Joni

I'm sorry, Linda, but I failed to find a "stupid comment" on your posts. And what is wrong with being carried away with your emotions? I said, that day, that I was being a be-deviled egg's advocate (pun and double entendre intended). It is laudable that we see the "...flaws and shortcomings of societies whose decency, if imperfect, is without parallel in human history."-Ralph Peters (FIGHTING FOR THE FUTURE). It is also laudable to hope that society will do it's best to treat it's members justly and humanely. Peters also said "The primary function of any civilization is to restrain human excess." We cannot just see the wrongs that could be done by society. We have to also hope for it to do it's best. It is from the minds of those who do the latter that great expectations and changes come from. Our value, if nothing else, lies in our ability to "think outside the box" (I'm sorry, I had to say it ....whip me, beat me; make me date bad Czechs) In case you have NOT realized it, Linda, I do, sometimes, propose ideas for discussion that I do not necessarily support and hope to see other's ideas. I have been very wrong, many many times in my life, when I had an unshakable belief. How do you know your comment was not perceptive, insightful, thought-provoking and valuable? It certainly made me think. I said it scared me....I did not say you were wrong. If we avoided all we feared we would all be sitting in a closet, alone. Sometimes we have to take chances to have progress. It may kill us, but we TGs are evolution's disposable "power up" in the game of life. Lets risk thinking, proposing, acting, doing things nobody else does. We are the Gendernauts! We go where no man has gone before....except Ru Paul.

<And what is wrong with being carried away with your emotions?>

In my experience it can lead to quite some problems. Like saying (and expressing in whatever way) the wrong things at the wrong place and time. Wrong that is, if you do not want to lose friends or lose out in other ways. I think that, in a way, you have given the answer yourself, Wendy: Scaring the hell out of people - and not even suspecting that you do - this surely can lead you into great trouble. It may not be "wrong" and, of course, it could be a good thing at times - even taking great chances. But the price paid can be very high.

Linda

Linda,
The other side is denying your emotions. Locking them up. Becoming somebody else and living their life. I did this. It was a mistake. I almost died from it a number of times in my life. The value of species diversity is that in any event, some of us will survive THAT event...and some of us will not. I have said far more through guessing, instead of feeling, that created disaster and hurt than I ever did through an excess of emotion. Being Spock (Mr. not Dr.) sucks. It's "safe" but it's no way to live. There is no "right" way to be all the time. Use all your brain, use your best judgement, but live. Hiding emotionally is worse for you than hiding physically. Right now I must "hide" Wendy but I don't hide from her inside myself and I let more of her out in my life. The price of hiding from my emotions has just been too high to let it continue. I know t-girls who will die before being girls....bad choice. I choose to live.

Using all of our brain...

Wendy,
something definitely happened to my brain a month or so ago. As I wrote further up on this thread: I have tried this kind of twist-your-brain-space-test before but never with such a bad result. Being in a definite state of transition (no, not HRT, not yet anyway) and working with computer programming for a couple of months it seems to me that I reached some point of no return - like the the point where a mathematical function "jumps" to the other side when reaching an asymptotic line. This was when I finally reached my memories from my eleventh year - entering the memories and feelings from that time. When I chose the expression "twist-your-mind-space-test" it was for a special reason: Reaching this "asymptotic line" I was reminded of how I struggled with mathematical problems in my teens - always trying to visualize them geometrically and almost feeling my brain twisting when forcing myself through this. I did succeed somehow. But it did not come in a natural way to me - as opposed to languages - the typically feminine intellectual ability.
But one month ago I said to myself - I will not do this to myself anymore. I am hurting myself. And then my feelings seemed to be turned free from this twisted old framework. Of course, not being able to complete the programming course was definitely worth it. "Programming course" somehow seems to have had a double meaning/reference here.

Linda