September 21, 2008 4:27 AM BST
“…Wal-Mart… I can at least exchange the product.”
One’s legal right to exchange a product if in possession of a receipt, is absolutely non gender-related! Surely that’s the same in the States, isn’t it…?
Any sign dissuading “our type” of customers would be illegal here in the UK, sadly not in all parts of the USA apparently.
As to Rae’s quandary, which was in April so I guess she’s calmed down about it now…
Generally speaking, if someone is really making an effort to present, totally and utterly, as female, I would like to see shop assistants understanding and respecting the reasons behind that, and allowing them into the changing rooms of their obvious gender.
If a guy goes into a female changing room to try on a pair of girl’s jeans, I understand and respect any shop’s policy of avoiding such awkwardness for their female customers. Guy’s should be, and almost certainly are in the UK – allowed to try on female clothes in the guy’s changing rooms.
Hard to get my point across tactfully without trannies everywhere jumping down my throat… but what I guess I’m saying is (generally speaking, nothing to do with Rae): “Androgyny” is not a good reason to be allowed into a female dressing room. I’ve seen types who are already wearing women’s jeans and, “this is not a shirt, it’s a blouse…” and think that is enough to be accepted as female. Well, whether or not it should be enough, the point is that they may describe themselves as androgynous but others see them as men. If you want to be accepted as female, especially in such intimate areas as female changing rooms, then you have to really make an effort to present as female.
This means: make-up to mask our crappy skin, a hairstyle or wig that does not scream out male or male-pattern-baldness, appropriate clothing, ie not 6” stiletto boots and a mini-skirt, or not an “androgynous” blouse that a hippie might wear, or any appearance in which you can pass as a bloke if you want to.
You don’t have to have natural feminine features, you just have to make an effort, and leave no-one in any doubt as to which gender you identify.
Sadly, I know of people who really have made the effort, but get read and therefore are disallowed entry into their changing room of choice, the fault in those cases lies with the perhaps over-zealous shop assistant, but I do understand it’s not always easy for staff who may not have come across that situation to make a snap decision, and not cause offence to the TG customer, or to the partially clothed girls in the changing rooms discussing each other’s outfits.
xx
September 21, 2008 5:40 PM BST
I think Rae's incident was just one of those things like a bad hair day or whatever, She just didn't come across to the sales gal the right way. Maybe the sales gal realized she made a mistake but was afraid to admit it.
I have not had any issues trying on things at Walmart, I'm thinking they only have one set of dressing rooms anyways. Years ago I recall them telling me I would need to wait a moment, I think for the gals to finish. Beyond that I think Lucy was quite right in how she viewed the usage of a women's dressing room.
I now try on just about every last thing I buy. With so much difference in sizing and fabrics it can be too costly to not try things on first. And I can only assume if someone is afraid to try them on, they won't be to eager to go back and return them if they don't fit. Definitely a costly proposition.
Hugs,
Marsha
September 21, 2008 5:47 PM BST
Unless I'm buying a complete outfit in one hit then I very rarely try on items in the shop except for jackets or coats. I try them at home because I want to see how they go with other items. I might be wearing flats when shopping but want to see if it goes OK with heels.
However if I'm in a different town/city then I will try it on.
Alina x
September 26, 2008 4:27 PM BST
Hi--
At least now you know. I had an interesting time a few years back when I went for a bra fitting (and you can read about that day
here), and discovered that not every store will treat you well...or poorly. And yet, as badly as it went in the one store, I've been back to buy things since. If there's a problem in one area for changing, I just shrug and go to the other. I do get read every so often, and my life doesn't end.
Still, I prefer shopping in places with unisex changing rooms; it simplifies life greatly.
Luv 'n hugs,
Mina Sakura
September 27, 2008 5:24 PM BST
The quick retort to, 'I'm sorry, men aren't allowed in the changing rooms' is to agree, and say, "I wouldn't want men in our changing room".
This reinforces your own gender, implies she made a mistake, and ought to produce an apology.
Does it work? Yes, I have used a similar reply in similar circumstances.
She is correct in that men are not normally allowed in female changing areas. Most stores will opt for suggesting an obvious male try on any clothes in the appropriate facility if they have one available.
September 28, 2008 1:30 AM BST
Hey!
Sorry, I had’nt noticed the thread had been reinvigorated! In my defence, I’ve had only limited access to the net due to my poor PC being swamped by a dozen or two virus’s when I was’nt looking – just about sorted now though. [Phew!]
I absolutely agree with virtually all the points made.
Marsha, you’re absolutely right, it was definitely a bad hair day! Normally I would’nt have been fazed but for some reason I was just caught up in what I was doing and left myself ill prepared to deal with the situation.
But I’m glad the discussion continues as it’s a very important area that most of us will come across at some point or other.
Lucy, I appreciate what you’re saying and your comments are’nt necessarily directed my way.. However I do use the term ‘androgynous’ to describe myself – maybe erroneously – because it seems to be the best fit of what I am. My body is by no means entirely male and by no means entirely female. Many people I meet who did’nt know otherwise make the assumption that I’m taking hormones. But neither can I be classed as intersexed. I had to class myself here as ‘transgendered’ as I am not a crossdresser/TV. To be frank, after way too many years of looking, I have’nt found anyone like me – and you’d have thought the net would have yielded a couple! Anyway, that’s things I should really think about blogging but, tbh, I’m not sure the interest would be there. But I know what you mean about a guy with a blouse…
Danique, wow, that’s the way the world should be…
Sue, if I’d been having a ‘normal’ day that’s exactly the response I would have made.
Anyway, as somebody so kindly reminded us all that this occurred way back in April, ahem, I will have to confess that I’m yet to contact New Look – but still have every intention of doing so. [I drive passed their Head Office every week!]
It got pushed back in my mind due to a whole host of other things and the ‘work around’ that I’ve adopted. Which is to buy my goods in New Look, then walk across the road to another shop with individual changing rooms, take any old item in and try on my New Look goods. Ok, not ideal, but it works for me.
But now this is back in my mind…
So much love
Rae xxx
October 14, 2008 11:28 AM BST
Just before you put this episode down to experience and file it away in your archive Rae, here's a note I received today from the horse's mouth so to speak.
This is Peter Robinson, from New Look who has read this thread at my insistence and replies as follows...
----- Original Message -----
From: Peter_Robinson
To: Katie
Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 9:22 AM
Subject: RE: Changing Rooms
Dear Katie,
Please find below a statement on our policy re changing facilities.
'New Look strives to ensure it meets and exceeds all the needs of our customers and that they have a private environment to try on our clothes. New Look welcomes feedback from our customers and actively looks to improve facilities where required through our improvement programme. New Look also operate a 28 day returns policy allowing customers to try on clothing at their own leisure.'
Best
Peter Robinson
Head of Press
New Look Retailers
2 Portman Street
London W1H 6DU
T: 020 7659 5933
F: 020 7659 5928
It may not be quite the apology I think you deserve but it is interesting to see that you can bring ill-fitting stuff back within 28 days.
Hugs,
Katie x
October 14, 2008 10:11 PM BST
Thankyou Katie. Your post is both appreciated and interesting.
Much love
Rae xx